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Thread: Custom blunt swords for bouting

  1. #1
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    Custom blunt swords for bouting

    Just curious if those who have had higher end custom swords produced are using them for practical full contact bouting, or are they preserved for ceremonial duties and the odd cutting exercises?

    The reasons I ask is that I have often wondered whether a more expensive custom sword would be a better/stronger candidate for bouting than the often cheaper mass produced swords.

    The path of this logic being a custom sword will hold up better in parts and components to bouting than a mass produced item of lesser value. Anybody care to elucidate?

    Cheers and Merry Grimble.

  2. #2
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    Bouting...? As in, edge to edge contact...? With a sharp sword...? Now, why would anyone want to do something like that, even if it wasn't crazy-dangerous...?

  3. #3
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    I dont think he meant bouting with a sharp. I picked up a custom Tinker off Ebay years ago that was a blunt.

  4. #4
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    No, clearly NOT with a sharp blade ... I'm talking about high end blunts; a blade can be easily sharpened as well as blunted. Please consider the question in sane terms - I didn't think I needed to spell out the use of blunts for bouting as I thought it was self evident sharps would not be employed.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by S.J.White View Post
    Just curious if those who have had higher end custom swords produced are using them for practical full contact bouting, or are they preserved for ceremonial duties and the odd cutting exercises?

    The reasons I ask is that I have often wondered whether a more expensive custom sword would be a better/stronger candidate for bouting than the often cheaper mass produced swords.

    The path of this logic being a custom sword will hold up better in parts and components to bouting than a mass produced item of lesser value. Anybody care to elucidate?

    Cheers and Merry Grimble.
    Sorry, just, the above marked part had me confused, so I just wanted to make sure I DID misunderstand...

    Sorry again.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hrvoje Samija View Post
    Sorry, just, the above marked part had me confused, so I just wanted to make sure I DID misunderstand...

    Sorry again.

    The reason I said that was to differentiate between those who only use their high end custom swords for ceremonial use and cutting vs those who bout theirs as blunts. There may well be two camps or more ... I am wanting to hear from those with custom swords who use them ( blunts ) for bouting vs the use of cheaper mass produced swords.

  7. #7
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    I guess that, maybe, this is not the optimal sub-forum for this kind of question... Maybe in the Swordsmanship-Community there would be more biters...

    That being said, let me just bother your thread once more about the blunts and sharps... I have spoken with a person far more knowledgeable than me on that subject, and was surprised that a blunt and a sharp of the same type, with the same weight and balance, did not LOOK even remotely the same... The way I understood the explanation is, that depending on the blade geometry, it is not all that easy to blunt a sharp blade to a safe edge thickness, and have the same weight/balance once done... Also, sharpening a blade that was designed from the beginning to be a blunt, might leave you with a completely different sword in the end...

    Sorry once more for yet another side-track... Carry on...

  8. #8
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    The topic header has been changed to reflect the intent of the original question.

    Talk to the makers re construction of bouting swords vs blunt wall hangers. While some blunts are fairly easy to put a cutting edge on, most makers will finish their bevel grinds a bit different if being meant as a blunt for stage/bouting, There may be considerations for grip components as well for a sword going full speed frequent minor impacts and more or less 24/7 (sic). Even the Albion squire line that get (can be ordered) sharpened have different finish grinding from those that are sharp by default in Albion's other lines.

    Del Tin on the other hand are generally sold only as blunt originally but there are exceptions. If ordering direct from Del Tin, I know in the case of my 5157, the original owner/buyer had requested as tight a bevel as Fulvio could permit to export. So there is one case where a "blunt" was sharpened and there was little change in the geometry once sharp. However, that one as received from Del Tin really would not have met the criteria most regard as a blunt for unarmored bouting. Indeed, even as is, I think you will find some feel even the standard blunt Del Tins not so safe fo such use.

    More to the original question. The time I walked up to John Lundemo's table in 2001, on one side of the display were a handful of knightly one hand swords with quite thick edges and making them was something John had been doing for some time for his own tenure as fighting and for others to use. They had all the profile look, just as the Albion Squire line do but made originally for blunt work.

    Cheers

    Hotspur; the whole sharpening topic can be a whole dissertation in differences in individual abilities and tools

  9. #9
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    I'll try and rephrase the question ... all I am intending to find out is this.

    # - Does anybody here bout with a blunt, high end custom made sword, in the $800-$1500 realm?

    # - Further to that, are the swords that people custom order, usually reserved for just cutting exercises and ceremonial occasions - or do some people pay big money for a custom sword and use it as a blunt bouter?

    That ought to make things simple.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by S.J.White View Post
    I'll try and rephrase the question ... all I am intending to find out is this.
    # - Does anybody here bout with a blunt, high end custom made sword, in the $800-$1500 realm?
    Yes

    # - Further to that, are the swords that people custom order, usually reserved for just cutting exercises and ceremonial occasions - or do some people pay big money for a custom sword and use it as a blunt bouter?
    Yes, to both
    That ought to make things simple.

  11. #11
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    I should like to hear from those people ... I assume those who have responded so far are not among them.

  12. #12
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    I've made several high end blunts for stage combat and sparring bouting that were well over $800. Sometimes this was due to the person wanting etchings in the blade or pommel or hand carving. Most times they were made to resemble their sharp counter parts. There are plenty, I assure you, people out there who have the scratch and actually use their high end pieces without hesitation and in most casses ordered them special for that reason. Part of the fun of putting together an outfit or persona for some folks is to complete the package with a family motto or crest or evil name on the blade.
    "Ah, the old disco room.......just as I left it!" Cassanova Frankenstein

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  13. S.J.

    All of us at TDS train and fight with custom swords made for us by Dennis Graves. The basic weapon probably starts around $350 and the very custom weapons easily approach $1000 in value.

    To date we have had no damage to speak of. These weapons range from Classical Italian foils to late rapiers and include dueling sabres (although the sabres are much less expensive).

    This is what we do, we are swordsmen and we use our best tools for the job. The only time I'll keep my weapon in my bag and pick up a piece of crap is when I need to match the output of my opponent. I don't believe in putting my favourite sword in harms way of an ignorant.

    DA
    Trovare Di Spada

    higher good is like water: the good in water benefits all, and does so without contention

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