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Thread: Maker's mark??

  1. #1
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    Maker's mark??

    Hello All,

    Any thoughts on this marking? Spanish? Portuguese? Italian?

    Thanks!

    M~
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    mark@swordforum.com

    ~ Hostem Hastarum Cuspidibus Salutemus ~

    "Those who beat their swords into plowshares usually end up plowing for those who don't."
    Benjamin Franklin

  2. #2
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    Hello,

    I've done some research on this marking.
    it seems to be Horstmann (Philadelphia).
    Source: "The american sword" by Harold L. Peterson (p. 120)

    All the best


    William

  3. #3
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    Can you share the rest of the sword?

  4. #4
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    Nice detective work there, William. Wish there was a close-up of that marking in Peterson's, but from what can be seen it sure does looks the part. The hilt does seriously put me in mind of the Philadelphia City Cavalry type. No other markings or engravings on the pipe back blade to connect the sword to Horstmann, though.
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    mark@swordforum.com

    ~ Hostem Hastarum Cuspidibus Salutemus ~

    "Those who beat their swords into plowshares usually end up plowing for those who don't."
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  5. #5
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    William. You must have a different printing of Peterson than I (1991). In mine, page 120 shows a photo of a mounted officer in the Phillipines.
    "Ancora imparo - Michelangelo Buonarotti"

  6. #6
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    Mine is a 1996 printing of the 1965 revision. The description i in regard to sword 109 and spans my book from 119 to 121 with a full plate on 120. At any rate, 109 is an 1872 mounted artillery sword with a description of that mark opposite the Horstmann mark.

    Without a Horstmann mark, I would be of the same train of thought Mark mentions. I do not find the h in a shield in a couple of different German catalogs of marks but is the mark we see even an H? I dunno. There was an younger Karl Weyersburg, for instance

    This should load ok and is a fairly comprehensive look at German cutlers and toolmakers late in the 19th > century.
    http://files.myopera.com/3sails/files/cutlermarks-1.pdf (about 1.2 mb)

    Cheers

    Hotspur; I think we have a couple of Philly First Troop threads or mentions over the years and those are quite fancy etched jobs but do look like this. J&J Militaria as well as Horse Soldier have examples up.

  7. #7
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    I have been comparing many German swords imported into the USA. This mark seems to have been used on low end swords made by by WKC and sold through many US dealers. There is an animal mark that is commonly found, that I think was used by WKC for better quality export swords.

  8. #8
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    I, too, have seen this mark on ca.1880s-1890s American officers' blades.

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    Thanks for the additional feedback, guys. Though this one appears to be of the type, the few Philadelphia Cavalry swords I've seen all seem to be profusely etched and clearly identified to that corps. Does anyone know if this type was simply a non-regulation pattern or something more specific to the PCC?
    mark@swordforum.com

    ~ Hostem Hastarum Cuspidibus Salutemus ~

    "Those who beat their swords into plowshares usually end up plowing for those who don't."
    Benjamin Franklin

  10. #10
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    Chicago Black Horse Troop

    This saber is marked Chicago Black Horse Troop. Labeled The M.C. Lilley Co. It appears to be of the style above.
    Lilley imported a lot swords from WKC. But I am not sure about this one. If it was imported, it could have been before 1890. Any thoughts?
    Some day, I shall put some time into this saber.
    In 1877, The First Cleveland Cavalry, also called the 'Black Horse Troop', was established.
    They donated some surplus horses to Culver Military Academy; who then created their own 'Black Horse Troop'. I spend three summers in the Culver 'Cavalry' and on Sundays we Paraded 100 horses and they were all black. It is hard to fined an all black horse, so a lot of die was used. That is how I obtained my first 02.
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  11. #11
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    Thanks for the flowers Mark
    I know that there are some fencing foils/epees with that marking, that's why I did the research.
    @ Rob: I have to admit, I don't own the book. I found this information via google (google-books).

    May I ask which firms sold blades to Horstmann?

    William

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