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Thread: Please identified sword 2

  1. #1

    Please identified sword 2

    Hi
    Please help identify this sword and it is somewhat valuable?, (no need monetary value) Autentic or reproduction?

    Thanks for anything information !
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    Last edited by edwardauskis; 09-13-2017 at 11:31 PM.

  2. #2
    Hi Edward
    We are not appraisers, what is your intention with these swords? Are you intending to keep them or value them for resale?

  3. #3
    This sword not mine and I dont known buy him or not :?

  4. #4
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    I would lean toward late colonial Portuguese cup hilt.
    Last edited by Eric Fairbanks; 09-13-2017 at 09:01 PM.
    The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people." --- Tench Coxe

  5. #5
    More photos
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  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by edwardauskis View Post
    This sword not mine and I dont known buy him or not :?
    Hi Edward
    You'll have to make your own mind up as to value.
    I would say that it is a nice sword.
    As Eric suggests, Portuguese is possible, I personally wouldn't discount Spanish.
    It looks authentic to me from the pictures, but that's not the same as holding the sword and checking it properly.

  7. #7
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    Edward, I called a possibility of Portuguese because it uses brass fittings in the hilt which is a trait I see rarely
    on Spanish Colonial blades. Colonial because it has a minimal pommel for weight and appears to utilize a heavy cup and quillions for a blade balance. But as Gene said it does have a Spanish look or style to it and I also agree it looks real enough. Hard to say with these on origin. It is a very nice example and well worth owning but I do have a soft spot for these.Perhaps one of our Spanish members can help us. There is a thread Mike started that may help you. Eric

    http://www.swordforum.com/forums/sho...ilt-What-to-do
    The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people." --- Tench Coxe

  8. #8
    Very thanks guy's for reply !

  9. #9
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    Hi to all,

    According to the few letters I can see, in my opinion the inscription could read as 'MI SINAL ES' on one side, and 'EL SANTISSIMO CRUCIFIXO' (or 'CRUCIFIJO', J was in the process of substituting X by that time), on the other side. 'My signal is the Holy Cross'. It is not as popular as "NO ME SAQUES etc.", but not roo rare. I think that the Portuguese version was also used (difficult to tell between the two languages with so few letters), so the blade could be for their colonial market, as well as the Spanish one.

    Best,
    JJ
    SI, SI
    NO, NON

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Juan J. Perez View Post
    Hi to all,

    According to the few letters I can see, in my opinion the inscription could read as 'MI SINAL ES' on one side, and 'EL SANTISSIMO CRUCIFIXO' (or 'CRUCIFIJO', J was in the process of substituting X by that time), on the other side. 'My signal is the Holy Cross'. It is not as popular as "NO ME SAQUES etc.", but not roo rare. I think that the Portuguese version was also used (difficult to tell between the two languages with so few letters), so the blade could be for their colonial market, as well as the Spanish one.

    Best,
    JJ
    Very thanks for this info, how age this rapier?

  11. #11
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    Edward, I am terrible at dating old European blades especially the trade blades. Juan's information is interesting on this being a type of repeated marking for blade sales, but a wag for me would be middle to late 18th. Eric
    The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people." --- Tench Coxe

  12. #12
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    Edward, a wag for me would be middle to late 18th. Juan's information on these being a standard saying for sales to promote sales is very interesting. I am not familiar with this type trade blade so it is a guess. Eric

    Ok so it did not post the above post until I wrote the second and hit reply. Whats up with double posting.?
    The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people." --- Tench Coxe

  13. #13
    Juan said middle 18th. Thanks Juan and Eric!

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by juan j. Perez View Post
    hi to all,

    according to the few letters i can see, in my opinion the inscription could read as 'mi sinal es' on one side, and 'el santissimo crucifixo' (or 'crucifijo', j was in the process of substituting x by that time), on the other side. 'my signal is the holy cross'. It is not as popular as "no me saques etc.", but not roo rare. I think that the portuguese version was also used (difficult to tell between the two languages with so few letters), so the blade could be for their colonial market, as well as the spanish one.

    Best,
    jj
    now this rapier at my home and try read whats on blade. Juan is right, one side clean read "mi..." another side ".......ssimo x crucificio"
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  15. #15
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    Most excellent congratulations Edward a very nice sword indeed. My sign is the cross! Eric
    The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people." --- Tench Coxe

  16. #16
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    Juan, if I may ask what approximate years did Solingen sell these sword blades start to completion. Regards Eric
    The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people." --- Tench Coxe

  17. #17
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    Hi,

    I have no fixed dates, since Solingen was exporting blades to Spain long time before (Toledo production was not enough to cover demand, and German prices were lower), but I think that this sort of blades, in similar hilts and with these or similar inscriptions, date from late 17th to mid-18th centuries. A bit later maybe for the Hispanic America market.

    But curved saber blades, with such inscriptions and made in Solingen, were still in production during the Independence Wars, in the 1820's, along with the well-known tri-fullered cavalry straight blades. However, both are different from the type we're discussing here.

    Best,
    Juan J
    SI, SI
    NO, NON

  18. #18
    Juan, where I can see similar incription in better quality, try finding internet, but and there my knowledge is not enough

    P.S. BTW, next week I go to your beautiful country, Spain/ Barselona
    Last edited by edwardauskis; 09-27-2017 at 04:22 AM.

  19. #19
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    My sign is the cross

    My Sign is the Cross trade blade
    Total 42 7/8
    Blade 34 1/16
    Wide 1 1/2
    Thick 1/8 blade 1/4 at ricasso
    Fuller 12
    POB 2 3/8 from hilt
    Weight 2.12 lb
    obverse XXXX EL XX SANTISSIMO X CRUCIFIGIO
    reverse XXX MIN XX SINAL XX H ES XX
    most likely rehilt in Victorian or later period
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    The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people." --- Tench Coxe

  20. #20
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    Total 108.902 cm
    Blade 86.7833 cm
    Wide 3.81
    Thick 0.3175
    Fuller 30.48
    POB 6.0325 from hilt
    Weight 1.252 kg
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    The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people." --- Tench Coxe

  21. #21
    Thanks very much. Eric!
    My is :
    Total- 95.5 cm
    blade -79.7 cm
    wide - 3.5 cm
    weight- 0.89 kg

  22. #22
    This sign i think cross, right? On blade inside hilt
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  23. #23
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    Both represent the Cross of Caravaca:

    Name:  Z_cruz_caravaca.jpg
Views: 93
Size:  12.0 KB

    A most venerated relic in Spain, allegedly housing a piece of the Holy Cross (Lignum Crucis).

    JJ
    SI, SI
    NO, NON

  24. #24
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    Thanks for your information Juan, a most interesting sword even if very late for its style. Eric
    The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people." --- Tench Coxe

  25. #25
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    Sorry, wrong location
    Last edited by Richard Schenk; 10-12-2017 at 09:56 AM.

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