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Thread: Cleanest 1873 Prussian Artillery sabre Help please

  1. #1
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    Cleanest 1873 Prussian Artillery sabre Help please

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Size:  90.8 KBI’m trying to run down the unit for this Prussian beauty 類Any help would be much appreciated. Also worthy of note is the interesting manner in which this example has been sharpened. I’m guessing to slash through wool ?? Any thoughts?
    Last edited by B.Evans; 01-15-2018 at 09:48 PM.

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    Having a time loading photos 😕

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    Last edited by B.Evans; 01-16-2018 at 02:05 AM.

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  9. #9
    Hi 'B'

    These are real survivors!
    One of the more common sword types for sure.
    I have one myself!

    Have a look at this thread:
    http://www.swordforum.com/forums/sho...rtillery-saber

    My one is the most 'modern' sword that I own.
    I've not seen one with the bluing of the scabbard as perfect as yours.
    The sharpening looks like someone had a bash at it with a dremel.

  10. #10
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    This type of sharpening damage can be removed with filing and stoning.
    This is a laborious job taking hours to complete but may be worth it since in its current condition value has been lowered significantly.

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    This sabre was packed in an extremely thick coat of cosmolean both inside scabbard, blade , and handle when purchased here in the Pacific Northwest.. Doesn’t add up that it was sharpened with a dremel , and then packed in cosmolean .If you look at the uniform serration pattern I feel like this was done with an powered stone in an armory . However I appreciate the opinions .. Name:  96699943-26D6-4E7E-9AF8-8D4D17097C6D.jpg
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    Also .I would never touch a thing on this beautiful weapon let alone hack into it with a file and stone . No sir !! She sleeps within arms reach of me ,and other than my firm belief to never ever take away material from an artifact ( especially for monitory gain ) it’s nice knowing that God forbid I ever need to close the gab on an intruder that I will be passing through all layers .. ALL LAYERS 🤗

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Size:  96.2 KBAny ideas what that is under the crown above the 37 ?
    I’m thinking possibly a regiment designator like Cav or Inf .. Anybody seen this one before . Thank you in advance 類

  14. #14
    Looking at your additional pictures, it seems to have been the work of a bench grinder or similar.
    The uneven grind pattern that gives the effect of 'serration' is not a desirable outcome.
    A practiced hand would have achieved a more uniform result.
    The wheel used was a rough grinding wheel and not a smooth sharpening wheel that one might use on a tool.

    The evidence would indicate that the sharpening was done after the sword's 'service life'.

  15. #15
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    Gentlemen: In 1914, the Germans sharpened their issued weapons. This one is typical of that era. The Prussians had a technique of using a water cooled wheel, and afterwards, they hit the edge with a file. This was to cut through the heavy winter wear of the Russians on the Eastern Front. The Prussians remembered the difficulty they had with the Danish in the war of 1864. The Danish Cavalry had some kind of leather overcoat that was difficult to deal with effectively, so in WW 1, they were prepared for the Russian heavy garments. Note: This saber is also marked "1920" so it served after WW 1, and further, the Germans ceased marking units on the weapons in 1916...

    Dale

  16. #16
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    Hi Dale the 3rd photo shows some lack of control with a grinder, this was acceptable? 1920 was marked as the treaty allowed so many arms to be retained by Germany.

  17. #17
    Hi Dale,

    I've seen a hell of a lot of field sharpened sabres in my time and none were done with this lack of skill or on such a seemingly small and narrow wheel.
    I remember (many years past) watching a traditional water cooled stone wheel sharpen a variety of blades and having a brief go myself!
    I don't recognise this damage as the result of that kind of wheel.
    But every day's a school day!

    You've got barrels of these, can you show others with this sort of 'effect' on the blade?
    You are the expert on these so if you say it's right, I'm sure it is.

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    Wil: It seems to me to be within the variation of service use, but it is at the edge of technique, at least to me it is. With so many armorers grinding so many sabers, one might expect such variation.

    Dale

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    Lightbulb Variation in grinding.

    It is up to the owner to decide, I cannot prove that this was done after service. It is a bad job, but there were reports at the time of such..What troubles me is the use of a narrow wheel, but that could be due to wartime expediency---it is hard to say for sure.

    Dale

  20. #20
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    I’m certain this is a 1915 produced Sabre as the 15 under Bills crown would suggest.. The fact that this weapon was literally stuffed to the brim especially inside scabbard where the blade was housed for years with copious amounts of cosmolean . ( I’m talking hair dryer for several hours to get it somewhat melted outta there) And the fact of this was BRUTAL WAR WW1 Trench warfare men killing men through thick wool and leather.. Keeping in mind that yes their are going to be differences in quality , which by the way is completely subjective to the guy whom must use this weapon against said wool and leather and flesh and bone ... I personally as an Infantryman myself would actually prefer this type of edge against those medium.
    I also believe this is one of the finest if not THE finest example of a this model combat Sabre .. The 1796 should be proud as I am ...

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    Name:  BB23FBCB-7B25-41C2-AC61-7B7016001C3C.jpg
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Size:  97.5 KBThank you all for your great input 珞
    Dale could you help me with possibly figuring out what unit this artifact belonged to and appropriate knot I should reunite this Sabre with ?

  22. #22
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    Thank you
    Gene , Will , and Dale for your thoughts .. I do humbly appreciate the valued input . Do any of you fellas have an idea about regiment ? Or What knot should accompany her ? I thought she might belong to an Infantry unit as the smaller crowns to me look as if they might have stacked R’s or doubled R ?? Which would be Infantry right ?

  23. #23
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    The time had long passed (Napoleonic Wars) since infantry carried swords. Mounted troops would have them, infantry definitely not.

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    Lightbulb Recruiten Depot of Reserve Inf Rgt.

    B.Evans: This was the issue saber for mounted artillery troopers. I do not think the infantry carried this weapon in WW 1. All I see is: 1st (Battery), Weapon # 152. Double R would be on a IOD 89 or a bayonet, but not on an Artillery Saber----I have posted an IOD alter Art Mod 1816, Used from 1816 to 1889 and Issued to higher ranking NCO's.

    This one is interpreted as: 53rd (Inf Rgt) Reserve, Recruiten (Depot) 5th Co. Weapon No. 1. {Note: It was assumed that the first number, if not modified by a branch designation, was automatically "Infantrie"}

    Dale
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    Last edited by Dale Martin; 01-16-2018 at 06:09 PM. Reason: add pix...

  25. #25
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    Thank you ��
    After 1916 Prussian Empire stopped the practice of stamping unit numbers on this type of gear is what I’ve read in other post / forums etc etc .. Was hoping to figure out Regiment by numbers and stamps somehow .. This Sabre has this little crown looking stamp all over it it seams . Well the guard and backstrap anyway�� I wonder if a guy could figure out exactly what that meant if he’d be any closer ��Name:  C7CEF3AF-4FFA-4553-A375-D9B019C98BBB.jpg
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