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Thread: Nagamaki

  1. #26
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    More pics

    Originally posted by Guido Schiller
    I just found another pic in one of the Ch˘shűya catalogs
    that fits right in this thread: a Nagamaki-naoshi Katana. The
    interesting part is that it's a Shinsakut˘ that was forged this
    way.

    When I look at the Naginata-hi I'd rather say "Naginata-naoshi",
    but who am I to argue with the experts ...

    [...]

    Price tag: Yen 700,000.-
    I assume that was for the bare blade, without koshirae etc.
    Seems I'm starting to become "conditioned", as I am no longer
    as shocked by nihon-to prices as I used to be...

    Continuing this fine thread, here are two images I persuaded
    someone to find for me. I have no info, but if Guido is in a good
    mood, perhaps he'll translate some of the text.
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Last edited by A. Bakken; 01-12-2003 at 10:43 AM.
    Aage

  2. #27
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    Next one

    Originally posted by Guido Schiller
    When I look at the Naginata-hi I'd rather say "Naginata-
    naoshi", but who am I to argue with the experts ...
    As a PS: It seems everyone has their own way of defining
    naginata vs. nagamaki. If someone could present more
    conclusive evidence towards a standardized definition, that
    would be most interesting. Perhaps someone should make
    a polearm webpage, similar to the recent no-dachi web
    presentation?

    Anyway, here's the next picture. I have no source
    references, unfortunately.
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Last edited by A. Bakken; 01-12-2003 at 10:44 AM.
    Aage

  3. #28

    translations

    O.k., being gently nudged by Aage into translating here we go:

    1. photo
    Nagamaki
    Mumei (Den Katayama Ichimonji)
    Fu Kuronuri Naginata Koshirae

    2. photo
    ďnaginata
    Mumei (Den Musashi-b˘ Benkei H˘n˘)
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  4. #29
    Jűy˘ Bunkazai
    Naginata
    Mumei (Den Musashi-b˘ Benkei H˘n˘)

    (this seems to be the same as in Grant's pic)
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  5. #30
    Jűy˘ Bunkazai
    Naginata
    Mumei
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  6. #31
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    yeah thanks guido, at least the Shinsakut˘ smiths are still making these.

  7. #32
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    Hello. I am new and this is my first post. So how strange can I be to pick a year and a half old thread.
    But I was browsing the internet for Nagamaki information and evidently this thread is still the best source of information about the subject. I may have few more links to contirubte and have two question of my own please.

    First, I managed to come by this interesting thread talking about the two schools which still practice the Nagamaki (watch for more links at the bottom).
    http://pub40.ezboard.com/fsamuraibuj...picID=13.topic
    Apparently - "There are two ryu which still practice the weapon of this design in Japan, the Araki Ryu and the Toda-ha Buko Ryu. BOTH ryu use a weapon which has (very appr.) a five foot long haft, and about a three foot long blade ..."

    Unfortunately there isnt much info about these ryu on the net. Also I found Bujinkan as still practicing with this weapon ...
    Bujinkan (Ninjutsu) links:
    www.hanako.co.uk/Links/Li...jinkan.htm
    www.budovideos.com/shop/c...o_DVD.html
    Toda-Ha Bujo-Ryu links:
    www.aikidojournal.com/new...ticleID=16
    www.schoolofmartialarts.c...M_Buko.htm
    Araki-Ryu link:
    www.kenshindojo.org/

    Also as some of you already mentioned one site where one can fnd such a weapon -
    http://www.slobodianswords.com/Katana%2012%20Page.html

    My questions are please -
    1. Does any one know of other sites where I can find Nagamaki weapons for sale?
    2. Does any one know more about the Araki-Ryu and Toda-Ha Bujo-Ryu schools? Dojo links around the world?

    Thanks you, and I am glad to join this wonderful site.
    Regards,
    Tal Bustan.
    Last edited by Tal B; 01-23-2004 at 08:17 AM.

  8. #33
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    Welcome to SFI.

    Originally posted by Tal B
    Does any one know of other sites where I can find Nagamaki weapons for sale?
    Kris Cutlery's "Naginata III" is
    "approximately sort of Nagamaki-esque", but your best bet
    would definitely be to get it custom-made by a smith who is
    familiar with the style. Scott Slobodian and Howard Clark comes
    to mind, but what I would like to know myself, is whether any of
    the active Shinsakuto smiths makes these. Guido?
    Aage

  9. #34
    Originally posted by A. Bakken
    ..., but what I would like to know myself, is whether any of
    the active Shinsakuto smiths makes these. Guido?
    I don't know about any smiths who specialize in that kind of blade, but I guess it wouldn't be too difficult to have one made. I can think of at least two smiths who probably wouldn't say "no". I also can think of at least US $ 10,000 before they would lift their hammers. If you're interested, let me know.

  10. #35
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    Originally posted by A. Bakken
    Welcome to SFI.



    Kris Cutlery's "Naginata III" is
    "approximately sort of Nagamaki-esque", but your best bet
    would definitely be to get it custom-made by a smith who is
    familiar with the style. Scott Slobodian and Howard Clark comes
    to mind, but what I would like to know myself, is whether any of
    the active Shinsakuto smiths makes these. Guido?
    aage, for what its worth, howard can do the shape, but not the hi..

    but while we're on the subject of nagamaki shaped blades... guido, any idea how much a japanese made 21 inch wakizashi in u no kubi style would run me?
    I like swords.

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  11. #36
    Originally posted by Jeff Ellis
    guido, any idea how much a japanese made 21 inch wakizashi in u no kubi style would run me?
    From one of the good, but not award winning smiths, about US $ 8,000 +/- (probably "+" at this length).

  12. #37
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    Originally posted by Guido Schiller
    From one of the good, but not award winning smiths, about US $ 8,000 +/- (probably "+" at this length).
    ok thanks.

    was just cruous

    thats fully mounted?? or bareblade? i should have made that bit clear....
    I like swords.

    ______________________________
    SCHOLA GLADIATORIA
    ______________________________

    If you want to climb a mountain, begin at the top.

    "Integrity, justice, courage, and action - without these, a person is of no consequence." - Don Nelson

    learn the way to preserve rather than destroy.
    avoid rather than check, check rather than hurt, hurt rather than maim, maim rather than kill.
    for all life is precious, not one can be replaced.

  13. #38
    I was thinking "sword only" by a Nyűsen smith; however, I can't pin the price price down exactly, I was trying to give you a ball park figure, based on what I've seen so far.

  14. #39
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    Originally posted by Guido Schiller
    I was thinking "sword only" by a Nyűsen smith; however, I can't pin the price price down exactly, I was trying to give you a ball park figure, based on what I've seen so far.
    ok thanks.

    someone said he thought 4600... but i didnt believe him, and i know you have more experience at this.

    thanks

    maybe i'll have an osaraku tanto made in japan someday... hehe i'll be able to afford that
    I like swords.

    ______________________________
    SCHOLA GLADIATORIA
    ______________________________

    If you want to climb a mountain, begin at the top.

    "Integrity, justice, courage, and action - without these, a person is of no consequence." - Don Nelson

    learn the way to preserve rather than destroy.
    avoid rather than check, check rather than hurt, hurt rather than maim, maim rather than kill.
    for all life is precious, not one can be replaced.

  15. #40
    A. Bakken,


    I believe this is a picture of a naginata due to the length of the shaft (ebu) being longer than most nagimaki. Nagimaki are known for being useful on horseback because of the length and a long ebu is less effective. The weapon that man is holding is consistant in length with that of naginata.
    Naginata blades come in many shapes and sizes. I think that when people see a naginata with a long, sword like blade, it can sometimes be mistaken for nagimaki.




    (Student of Atrashi Naginata of 3 years under Sensei Helen Nakano) http://www.scnf.org/
    http://www.naginata.org/inf/inf.html
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Last edited by R.C. Russell; 10-29-2005 at 04:26 PM.

  16. #41
    Hello,

    The one defining feature that separates a naginata from a nagamaki more than anything else is a naginata hi or lack there of in the case of a nagamaki. As Guido indicated naginata were made from very early times. Nagamaki which were mounted on poles of between 3' to 4' in length and often mounted with tsuba, became somewhat popular about the late Kamakura period and primarily used in front line fighting of mounted samurai on horseback. This was particularly the case of Oda Nobunaga's troops in the muromachi period.

    In the late Kamakura period naginata's and nagamaki's were very similar in shape, again, with the primary difference being a naginata hi and a nagamaki being of slightly longer lengths. Please note that as in many cases, when it comes to nihonto there will be the "exceptions to the rule" .

    The strongly curved (sakizori) and broadening seen in naginata became prominent beginning in the muromachi period and later. This is an important kantei point in determining whether a naginata naoshi is earlier (kamakura-nambokucho) or later (muromachi +). Oddly enough and interesting to notice that prints and paintings from the late Edo and Meiji period will sometimes depict naginata in a "Nambokucho" or "Kamakura" scene as being of the later shape seen in the shinto period.





    http://japantrip.tripod.com/japan/osafune2.html

    In the link above swords #2, #3, #4 are "naoshi". Swords #2 and #4 should be ID as naginata naoshi, and sword #3 is a nagamaki naoshi. Another item of note is the added yokote line when they were modified or polished, though some nagamaki might have had a yokote line originally according to Kokan Nagayama.



    GL
    Last edited by G. Liberatore; 10-29-2005 at 08:45 PM.

  17. #42
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    Well, I might as well clarify something.

    Originally posted by Tal B
    Hello. I am new and this is my first post. So how strange can I be to pick a year and a half old thread.
    But I was browsing the internet for Nagamaki information and evidently this thread is still the best source of information about the subject. I may have few more links to contirubte and have two question of my own please.

    First, I managed to come by this interesting thread talking about the two schools which still practice the Nagamaki (watch for more links at the bottom).
    http://pub40.ezboard.com/fsamuraibuj...picID=13.topic
    Apparently - "There are two ryu which still practice the weapon of this design in Japan, the Araki Ryu and the Toda-ha Buko Ryu. BOTH ryu use a weapon which has (very appr.) a five foot long haft, and about a three foot long blade ..."

    Unfortunately there isnt much info about these ryu on the net. Also I found Bujinkan as still practicing with this weapon ...
    Bujinkan (Ninjutsu) links:
    www.hanako.co.uk/Links/Li...jinkan.htm
    www.budovideos.com/shop/c...o_DVD.html
    Toda-Ha Bujo-Ryu links:
    www.aikidojournal.com/new...ticleID=16
    www.schoolofmartialarts.c...M_Buko.htm
    Araki-Ryu link:
    www.kenshindojo.org/


    My questions are please -
    1. Does any one know of other sites where I can find Nagamaki weapons for sale?
    2. Does any one know more about the Araki-Ryu and Toda-Ha Bujo-Ryu schools? Dojo links around the world?

    Thanks you, and I am glad to join this wonderful site.
    Regards,
    Tal Bustan.
    Eh, sometimes it seems that this is what I do for a living...
    The Araki-ryu of the Kenshin Dojo link above does not study nagamaki. It is an iaido school, Araki Mujinsai ryu Iaido. The Araki-ryu that do study nagamaki are very different. See www.koryu.com for more information about these schools. Also, Ellis Amdur has written about both schools, Toda-ha Buko ryu and Araki ryu in his books and chapters available from koryu.com. The Araki ryu torite kogusoku and the Araki ryu gunyo kogusoku which do study nagamaki are sogo bujutsu and study a variety of weapons and techniques and should not be confused with the Araki Mujinsai ryu Iaido which has focused on the sword.
    Last edited by J. Nicolaysen; 10-30-2005 at 09:49 AM.
    J. Nicolaysen

  18. #43
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    Didn't Fred Chen make a nagamaki....? I'm pretty sure I was drooling over it a while back.
    "We are all imprisoned by the dictionary. We choose out of that vast, paper-walled prison our convicts, the little black printed words, when in truth we need fresh sounds to utter, new enfranchised noises which would produce a new effect."
    Ś Mervyn Peake

  19. #44
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    The Hikida Shinkage Ryu uses the nagamaki (although theirs is slightly different to the typical nagamaki seen on this thread)


  20. #45
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  21. #46

    Hey now...

    that is interesting... looks like a improvised handhold for katana..... neat. Now that I'll have to steal for no reason for a comic .
    O, que sorpresa! Hay un gato en mis pantalones!
    Visit my not so awesome art here

  22. #47
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    Well, it's definitely not a katana - I'v heard some people call it a nodachi, but then, the head of the style in Japan calls it nagamaki, so I guess you can't argue with that...




  23. #48

    Ah...

    it doesn't have a normal tsuba... I thought that black thing was cloth or something. *ahem stupid me*

    neat.
    O, que sorpresa! Hay un gato en mis pantalones!
    Visit my not so awesome art here

  24. #49
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    No, you were right - it doesn't have a tsuba, and the black thing along the first section of the blade is cloth of some kind.

  25. #50
    While on the subject... I just received this yesterday. It has very significant historical value to Canada. I will be adding a page to my website to explain it over the next few months - as restoration progresses. Nagasa - 27 inches, mumei.
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    www.japaneseswordcollector.com

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