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Thread: The New Crossada knife (lots of pics)

  1. #1
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    Thumbs up The New Crossada knife (lots of pics)

    If you havent seen this page with LOTS of sweet pictures of the new and old generations of James Keating's CROSSADA knife then do yourself a favor and check it out!

    http://www.jamesakeating.com/MjkL.html

    This is a simply awesome weapon, one that can do it all in a combative situation like no other. Not for bass fishing or camping, but a fighting knife like no other.

    Best of all,

    Pete Kautz
    http://modernknives.com
    Last edited by Pete Kautz; 05-13-2005 at 02:41 PM.
    alliancemartialarts.com
    modernknives.com

  2. #2
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    Wish I could afford one right now =(

    Say, is there any info or pics out there on the Busse Combat version of the Crossada? I tried inquiring over at the Busse forums about it, but never got a reply.

  3. #3
    I seriously did not get that? The point of that is....What, exactly? Why am I supposed to pay $650 for it again?

  4. #4
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    Originally posted by D.A. Guertin
    I seriously did not get that? The point of that is....What, exactly? Why am I supposed to pay $650 for it again?
    Wouldn't you be glad to pay that for a knife that can do this?
    <snip>"the Crossada Fighting Knife needs to be considered on an entirely different plane of thought. The Crossada has the capacity to turn any man into a master knifefighter in a day or two."

    I'm not knocking the premise of this style of fighting, or the knife itself. It's the first I've really looked at it. The price is very subjective and there are alternatives for less money. The names behind it and the hype are what will drive the market. The comment I quoted above is a sad statement of marketing that will garner sales as well. I'm sure they will show up in various classifieds when the masses find some new grail. I imagine they will be valuble to collectors in twenty years.

    Thom has it right. Look at some similar alternatives for a quarter the price, or less.

    Cheers

    Hotspur; that is a good size side arm, if you can comfortably carry it

  5. #5
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    Sorry, double post. I don't know about the Busse, I do see a Cold Steel rumor out there.

    Don't get me wrong, it's a nice looking cookie cutter type knife. Somewhat unique but there are other knives out there. I can only say I'm a bit amused to discover Dozier was once involved. Funny, to me, because of his more common diminutive approach to the subject of self defense.

    Cheers

    Hotspur; to each their own
    Last edited by Glen C.; 05-13-2005 at 05:59 PM.

  6. #6
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    Actually, I'm not knocking the knife one bit.

    If I had the cash I'd order one myself.

    Keating is one of the few knife experts that has a "Brand" and actually knows what he's doing.

    There are a lot of folks out thereWho talk the talk, but when it comes to "walking the walk" their stuff'll get you killed.

    Really the Crossada is an excellently designed knife with great functionality.

  7. #7
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    Right on ThomJ! Some other folks seem to be missing the point here, so let's try to clear up some of the confusion, shall we?

    Up to now, the Crossada has not even been advertised publically for the simple reason that they are custom pieces and the interest far exceeded the supply. For years. Now they are available in enough quantity that they are being made available to the general public.

    Now, if you "just don't get it"...well, it clearly ain't for you then so why even post? The Crossada is for a person trained to use the knife to its maximum and it is completely unmatched by any other blade out there at what it does. This is not to say there are not 10,000 other great knives out there...just that none of them can do what a Crossada does when you know how. It is a superior tool for the job at hand.

    A Crossada is about the same price as any other custom knife, or a sword, or a handgun, so not that much in my book considering what a trained person can do with one. Again, your life priorities will determine such things.

    If one is serious about the martial arts training side of using the Crossada, by all means then start by just getting a trainer and learning the skills. The SKILLS are the other part of the deal, not just the knife. The weapons can't do it all by its self! But, put the skills with the knife and watch out. I have seen people with no training take the Bowie course with Jim Keating and be nailing guys with 20 years experience in the martial arts when they did the sparring. It's just the way it is.

    Best,

    Pete Kautz
    http://modernknives.com

    PS - Any rumor of Cold Steel manufacturing them is just that...they will not be making one. If you want one, here they are!
    alliancemartialarts.com
    modernknives.com

  8. #8
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    Originally posted by Pete Kautz
    Now, if you "just don't get it"...well, it clearly ain't for you then so why even post? The Crossada is for a person trained to use the knife to its maximum and it is completely unmatched by any other blade out there at what it does. This is not to say there are not 10,000 other great knives out there...just that none of them can do what a Crossada does when you know how. It is a superior tool for the job at hand.
    Why?

    Even if this kind of knife perfectly matches your fighting style and daily clothing there are still a lot of custom makers out there who could do the same for say $300, or even less.

    Just my opinion. Maybe I'm missing something very essential, but I'm seeing a large stock-removal knife with a deep hollow grind and a rather standard handle.

    But for me, this knife is just way too big to carry, and therefore not even considered. I couldn't conceal it, and certainly not justify it if I ever had to use it. Maybe that's just a local thing, but I know enough Americans that feel the same way.
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  9. #9
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    It's not an EDC carry knife. It's a knife for a specific purpose, knife dueling.

    And yes, you could get a similar knife for less, but it really is Keating's design and both he and the smith need to get paid.

  10. #10
    What I read on that website was basically that the knife was originally designed by one person, or developed by a key few, but has been produced in the dozens by any number of knife makers. Did I interpret that correctly?

    Also, I must say that I don't at all take offence to 'not getting it,' as I truly do not. This is a piece which is very large by most standards; far too bulky for any carry out of the hand, made over two inches thick with the quillions, and, what, a good two-plus inches in width? Perhaps there is a specialised set of techniques developed for the knife in question? I read now that this is a 'specialised tool,' equating it perhaps to James William's Osoraku tanto, marketed as hissatsu?

    Perhaps I have missed something, in that 'knife duelling' has been illegal in every state that I have lived in, and one would be subject to premeditate manslaughter charges at the minimum if it were put to use. Barring that, any military application is ruled out by the cumbersome design itself. This is starting to remind me of olympic fencing...
    Last edited by D.A. Guertin; 05-14-2005 at 08:07 AM.

  11. #11
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    Last I heard, sword dueling was illegal too, and they are far to bulky to carry around for military use.

    Yet pretty much everyone here collects swords and trains with them every day.

    What Mr. Keating is doing is preserving the art of Bowie Knife Dueling and providing a prime example of the knives used for it but made with updated materials.

    I think anyone here who criticizes Mr. Keating for providing a weapon for a specific style of fighting is being a bit of a hypocrite.

    Yes, it's expensive, but you don't have to buy it.

  12. #12
    That is insight on it that I appreciate hearing. Thank you. I don't completely agree with it, but I understand it, and appreciate it.

    Darryl

  13. #13
    Originally posted by Pete Kautz
    Now, if you "just don't get it"...well, it clearly ain't for you then so why even post? The Crossada is for a person trained to use the knife to its maximum and it is completely unmatched by any other blade out there at what it does. This is not to say there are not 10,000 other great knives out there...just that none of them can do what a Crossada does when you know how. It is a superior tool for the job at hand.
    Uh, if you don't want people who don't get it to post and ask about it, why did YOU even post? People who know about these super uber knives already know about them, posting is to bring them to the attention of those who don't.

    You seem pretty knowledgable about these, so what can they do that is unmatched by any other double edged or 1 1/2 edged dagger with quillions? And what's with the hole that sometimes has a little brass thing plugged into it, if you get attacked are you supposed to screw it in there so you have a 4-way guard? Would an attacker really let you take the time to do that?

    It seems like a halfway decient design, but the hype makes it sound like you pull it out of the sheath and it'll dance around fighting for you.

  14. #14
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    Originally posted by Pete Kautz
    Right on ThomJ! Some other folks seem to be missing the point here, so let's try to clear up some of the confusion, shall we?

    Up to now, the Crossada has not even been advertised publically for the simple reason that they are custom pieces and the interest far exceeded the supply. For years. Now they are available in enough quantity that they are being made available to the general public.

    Now, if you "just don't get it"...well, it clearly ain't for you then so why even post? The Crossada is for a person trained to use the knife to its maximum and it is completely unmatched by any other blade out there at what it does. This is not to say there are not 10,000 other great knives out there...just that none of them can do what a Crossada does when you know how. It is a superior tool for the job at hand.

    A Crossada is about the same price as any other custom knife, or a sword, or a handgun, so not that much in my book considering what a trained person can do with one. Again, your life priorities will determine such things.

    If one is serious about the martial arts training side of using the Crossada, by all means then start by just getting a trainer and learning the skills. The SKILLS are the other part of the deal, not just the knife. The weapons can't do it all by its self! But, put the skills with the knife and watch out. I have seen people with no training take the Bowie course with Jim Keating and be nailing guys with 20 years experience in the martial arts when they did the sparring. It's just the way it is.

    Best,

    Pete Kautz
    http://modernknives.com

    PS - Any rumor of Cold Steel manufacturing them is just that...they will not be making one. If you want one, here they are!
    Thanks for your take on it and a bit of clarification but this quote (that will live forever) just comes of strong and wrong.
    <snip>"the Crossada Fighting Knife needs to be considered on an entirely different plane of thought. The Crossada has the capacity to turn any man into a master knifefighter in a day or two."

    You both agree and disagree with that in your post. First by touting it as a knife that can perform these tecniques like nothing else available and then explaining that it is a whole system view as in "it's not just the knife".

    I know both James and yourself are well versed in
    martial arts and have both got a lot of great, positive feedback from practicioners. I applaud that but find the quoted statement to be a bit misleading and really poor marketing hype. The talent both of you have doesn't need the hype of a statement like that.

    Cheers

    Hotspur; the Cold Steel threads/rumors go back to 2002
    Last edited by Glen C.; 05-14-2005 at 01:46 PM.

  15. #15
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    Re: The New Crossada knife (lots of pics)

    You know..I remember a lot of the same hype when the Al Mar Warrior knife came out and was for a short time "The Knife" used by ComTech Knife training. James Keating was even praising how deeply it slashed into the fake arms used in the training. Now, I own an Al Mar Warrior and love the design. Even having a full tang version with a longer blade and integral guard with thumb ramp made. Will say that its price is on the high side, but will be made from CPM 30 SV steel.

    I also remember reading about the Crossada when it first came out. James said it was specifically designed for deep puncture wounds and limited slashing. As for the side mounted quillions...I never could figure out how and when you would attach them during a knife fight. Because in reality it would happen rather fast. But, I have liked the design, and if it weren't for the fact I have my books filled for 2 years on 2 custom blade orders..I would try for one of these. I like the heavier Gen I the best.

    I even got to handle one at a knife show. Had Keating's name on one side and Bob Dozier's stamp on the other. Made from D-2. It was selling for $300 because of a slight warpage from heat treating. Now, I looked down that knife and saw no such warpage..alas I also didn't have $300 for it either. At that time it was selling for $600. And that was right after it came out.

    To me this knife is just a large version to Rex Applegate's dagger with a 6 inch blade. Which I own the Boker version of as well. Just wish it had a stainless steel guard instead of brass.

    Again, this is a specialized knife...Its only reason for being. To disarm another knife and deep penetrating wounds. While it is a large knife, and would be cumbersome for practical carry. It will probably scare the heck out of a possible attacker when they see it.
    When you separate groups into "US" and "THEM" you automatically become one of "THEM"

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  16. #16
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    Yeah, that line about the "any man into a master knife fighter" is a bit cheesy and is pretty much marketing hype.

    The Crossada does have major advantages in its ability to trap your opponent's knife, but I think that's taking it a little bit too far.Still, as a marketing/PR bastard I don't really have any place to criticise it.

    It's a great knife and has many, many advantages.

    Also Darryl, I didn't mean to single you out there. I can be a bit blunt and tactless at times.

  17. #17
    Thom,

    Didn't feel singled out at all. I was genuinely curious, and I appreciated your take on it.

  18. #18
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    Thanks for posting that link, Pete. Sorry you got so much flak for it.

    I recommend before anyone who really wants to know what the Crossada is all about that they go ahead and take a look at the knife and James Keating in action. Let me tell you, it’s pretty amazing.

    If you haven’t yet, pick up a the first issue of Modern Knives where you’ll see a sweet segment of Keating teaching methods of blade-catching using the Cossada. Also, Keating has a bowie knife instructional video entitled “Crossada” that is a must have for anyone interested in big knife fighting.

    One last note: While I agree that comments like are simply hype, IMO you really need to see the man and knife in action before making comments that are too harsh. It’s all about making informed opinions.
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  19. #19

    Thumbs down

    I'll I know is that I'm not paying a single $1 for a knife that I can't carry without getting weard looks from people all the time for having it on my belt beacuse it's obviously far too big to keep consealed leagaly under WA state law... (Secondly, it would have to be a folding knife...)
    Last edited by Dane Hendricksen; 05-17-2005 at 06:15 PM.

  20. #20
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    Dane:

    The knife isn't meant for EDC...

    DOn't buy it if you don't want it.

    No one's forcing you.

  21. #21
    Sorry, please exuse me. Some of the stuff on the website just left me a little steamed.

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