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Thread: P 1885 stamp id?

  1. #1

    Question P 1885 stamp id?

    Recently got a bit more interested in two British cavalry swords, on my dads wall, for as long as i can remember! I presume them to be 1885 pattern, as they are stamped /89, and display an apparently common, maltese cross in the guard. Please correct any of my presumptions, as is the reason for typing this! If WD and the north, south type arrows, signify, war dept, then what of an S between two arrows? On top of the handle reads, A X then once again, an S between two arrows. Other stamps are a crown above 12 followed by an E underneath, and a pair of D,s, with Wd in between. One of them still has the scabbard, and original leather decoration on the handle.After finding several pictures of the same swords, I cant find a matching scabbard, as it seems, they have rings on opposite sides at the top, where as this has a ring at the top, then one further down. Any help with the stamps, and possible approx value, would be great! P.S. we believe they may never have been sharpened!

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miles R Kenyon View Post
    Recently got a bit more interested in two British cavalry swords, on my dads wall, for as long as i can remember! I presume them to be 1885 pattern, as they are stamped /89, and display an apparently common, maltese cross in the guard. Please correct any of my presumptions, as is the reason for typing this! If WD and the north, south type arrows, signify, war dept, then what of an S between two arrows? On top of the handle reads, A X then once again, an S between two arrows. Other stamps are a crown above 12 followed by an E underneath, and a pair of D,s, with Wd in between. One of them still has the scabbard, and original leather decoration on the handle.After finding several pictures of the same swords, I cant find a matching scabbard, as it seems, they have rings on opposite sides at the top, where as this has a ring at the top, then one further down. Any help with the stamps, and possible approx value, would be great! P.S. we believe they may never have been sharpened!
    The two arrows at this period are the mark of Government Stores being Sold as no longer required.

    X is the mark to denote the Convex side of the blade in the bending test for any future inspection tests.

    Crown over E over 12 in the Government Inspector's mark when the sword was first made.

    D- If the single D has a Broad Arrow inside the letter then this is the mark of Australian Land Forces. If the Arrow is under the D then this is Defence Department Australia post 1911.

    If the two D's have a broad Arrow between, then probably the first D is in fact an O and the O/|\D mark is Ordnance department New South Wales, Australia,

    Having said all this, photos would help
    Robert

  3. #3

    Thumbs up Cheers and apologies!

    Thanks very much for the reply, and apologies for incorrect stamp order. I will send photos asap. It does appear to be two Ds though, seperated by an arrow, and neglegted to mention an M, on the blade.
    >S< > < X A. D /i\ D /89 So which year was it made, and therefore which pattern? Still very confusing to me! As mentioned, pix are coming, along with new found sword, which we haven't even a remote idea what it may be, apart from the obvious! Fantastic forum, cheers Miles.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miles R Kenyon View Post
    Thanks very much for the reply, and apologies for incorrect stamp order. I will send photos asap. It does appear to be two Ds though, seperated by an arrow, and neglegted to mention an M, on the blade.
    >S< > < X A. D /i\ D /89 So which year was it made, and therefore which pattern? Still very confusing to me! As mentioned, pix are coming, along with new found sword, which we haven't even a remote idea what it may be, apart from the obvious! Fantastic forum, cheers Miles.
    As dated 1889 probably an 1885 (Long or Short) sword.
    M on the blade denotes that this sword was subject to New type of testing introduced in the Specification of 7th March 1889. The blade should also have VM on the back of the blade and VM on the right flat as well.

    These tests were recommended to the War office by Messrs Latham and Kirchbaum according to a Letter from Horse Guards written by the Director of Artillery to the Chief Inspector of Small Arms, Enfield , 3rd December 1888, (see attached)

    These changes were reflected in the memo from Army Inspection Department to Mole enclosing new specification dated 4th January 1889. (see attached)

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    Last edited by Robert Wilkinson-Latham; 03-08-2011 at 07:30 AM.

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