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Thread: Sabre at auction; Real or Fake?

  1. #1

    Sabre at auction; Real or Fake?

    Hello Chaps, I've been browsing these forums for a while now but haven't had cause to post, until now.

    I was recently browsing my local auctioneers' catalogue when I saw the attached picture, naturally I was curious and decided to attend a viewing day to examine the sabre (the other sword, described as scimitar was included in the lot however I was primarily interested in the sabre).

    After viewing the sabre I decided against attempting to bid for it. I had my suspicions that it was an aged replica and the blade was marked 'Made in India' which I couldn't see in the original sized photo. (The made in India mark made me think it was something Windlass or similar company would turn out).

    I was hoping you fine fellows could lend your expertise and let me know if I made the right call.

    Many Thanks all.
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  2. #2
    i have just started collecting swords [grand total ONE lol,i was pretty much xxxxxx slapped on that, so i am no way an "expert"]
    but i think you made the right call,people in the know might call them wallhangers

  3. #3
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Michigan, USA
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    917
    Anthony. We are not allowed to comment on on-going auctions on this forum but your post seems to indicate that it is closed. They are both modern made replicas.
    "Ancora imparo - Michelangelo Buonarotti"

  4. #4
    Thank you for getting back to me Rob. Although I was not aware of the rule mentioned rest assured the auction was concluded at time of the post.

    May I ask for some advice on spotting reproductions? (The made in India stamp was what primarily raised my suspicions, also I felt the scabbard looked artificially aged, are there any other tell tale signs on the sabre?)

    Thanks again

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Guildford, Surrey, England.
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    13,986
    Anthony,
    This example you posted is a very very common type of Indian tourist item - I presume most were made in the mid to late 20th century. Many of us have owned one of these before we knew what we were buying (I had one as a teenager), so well done on escaping it!
    Look long and hard at this example, because they are very common and all as alike as peas in a pod. The modern nut at the tang end, the horrible shiny fake leather grip, the crude hilt fittings with very thin metal guard. And of course 'Made in India' helps identify them! In fact I do not think they were ever made as 'fakes' per se, due to having 'Made in India' slapped openly on them. But many auction houses do not know anything about swords and could not tell an antique sword from a Toys R Us Christmas special.
    What are much harder to spot are the more recently made fakes coming out of India and China, many of which are modelled quite closely on original examples. The study of those fakes and how to avoid them is a more detailed and time consuming endeavour. The most common models of fake to encounter at the moment are 1854 pattern infantry officer's swords, 1853 and 1885 pattern cavalry troopers swords and 1912 pattern cavalry officers swords, from what I have seen. Study the swords on companies like Weaponedge and World Wide Arms, because those are the very same swords, from the same factory, as are often passed of as original. I have seen them listed as originals at auctions houses and from specialist dealers. Some people are fooled by them, others just don't care about the truth if there is a profit in it for them....
    Matt

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Michigan, USA
    Posts
    917
    Anthony. The shape of the blade, the thin guard, the fat, shiny, leather wrapped grip, the (wire?) wrapping on the grip, the shape of the backstrap the elongated pommel nut, and...... "Made in India." Regards, Rob
    "Ancora imparo - Michelangelo Buonarotti"

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