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Thread: Is This a Reverse P 1812 American Sword

  1. #1

    Is This a Reverse P 1812 American Sword

    I got this from a local guy. Rusty blade, round tip, black gloss painted grip, bent quillion. I do believe langets removed as a recess and rough brass where they would have sat. So I restored it after a couple dozen hrs to presentable condition. No factory markings. I thought maybe an American reverse P battlefield pick up, like seen in books. Pics 1 and 2 of sword now. Pic 3shows blade when I got it and gave the round end a proper contour. Good quality steel.Pic 4 and 5 show Engraved Initials and repair or filled in rectangle loop. Name:  001.jpg
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    Pics 1 and 2 of sword now. Last pic shows blade when I got it and gave the round end a proper contour. Good quality steel.[ATTACH=CONFIG]156888[/ATTACHName:  001.jpg
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    Last edited by G.J.West; 11-23-2020 at 04:53 AM.

  2. #2
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    I think I'd call it a D guard, vs a P/RP.

    The triple wire is kind of indicative of German work along with the flat ferrule. Also the unstopped fuller. The removal of the langet is a little curious but what we see as common to US style. Is there a slot for a sword knot?

    Cheers
    GC
    Last edited by Glen C.; 11-23-2020 at 04:51 AM.

  3. #3
    Join Date
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    Bow type knucklebow a later development than stirrup and reverse "P" hilts common to the Americas. Perhaps a British police sword.
    The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people." --- Tench Coxe

  4. #4
    Join Date
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    Knuckebow repair nearer the pommel could have changed the shape of it. I don't believe British police swords have langets and their blades are shorter. How long is the blade?

  5. #5
    OK added 2 more pics to Top Thread.
    There is script I.Y. engraved, I believe. And Slot is filled by someone, or it's a retangular brased repair.
    I know many of the Yank muskets I own or owed have Initials carved in them. Tradition?
    The filled slot is separating, might pull it out.
    Blade is 28.0 inches now, was 28.3 no tip. Who knows how long it was before it's tip got rounded blunt. There is a demarcation of steel both sides showing 1st third, harder grey and last 2 thirds shinny silvery. Has good flex to it.

  6. #6
    Join Date
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    When sword tips are thrust into harder objects like wood they tend to bend. Once bent the owner attempts to straighten it and it inevitably breaks. Looking at the fuller length I would think the blade not to be originally much more in length, maybe 29" ? Looks like it once had a leather grip, not shagreen. The smooth rounded pommel reminds me of Reeves swords made for India.
    Hangers were relatively inexpensive and took up less room to ship overseas. Earlier hangers circ 1800 are seen in Canada but this one is later, fullering reminiscent of the 1853p cavalry troopers sword. Later swords did not have the tell tale join from iron to steel blade.

  7. #7
    Join Date
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    Does the right side of the cross guard which is not pictured also have a flat edge suggesting langet removal? I would think the left side filed flat for more comfortable wearing, this hanger doesn't look as if it should have langets being later dating.

  8. #8
    Right side has flat spot too. There was some leather that came off with the paint. Does look like an iron steel join look, similar to my early Bess ram rods. Sparked nice similar to high carbon. I like it. Wonder who I.Y. was?
    Last edited by G.J.West; 11-23-2020 at 10:36 AM.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
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    Going by where you sourced the sword, though that becomes less meaningful with global shipping, in this case it may be helpful. The initials IY may well be a Canadian Militia officer, possibly artillery. British officer naming usually has at least three initials and since they brought their swords from thew UK it would be of official pattern where this sword can be supplied to officers in Canada. As you know most likely had a leather scabbard with brass mounts.
    The initials may lead you to an officer as the combination does not appear to be a common one. Maybe first initial is Ira, Ives or Ivor (Scottish)??

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