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Thread: A Baden Seitengewehr

  1. #1
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    A Baden Seitengewehr

    Gents,

    I picked up a very interesting German sidearm this week that I think is a Baden Border/customs sidearm (Badischen Seitengewehr). It appears to be a private purchase (Extra-Seitengewehr) so while it is certainly made in the Baden style it is not quite a regulation sidearm. The sidearm was made by Alexander Coppel and has a tiny "AC" maker mark on the lower edge of the blade ricasso as is found on other Coppel edged weapons. While it is not in any Coppel catalog that I have it is clearly a Coppel product from Imperial or Weimar Republic times IMHO.

    The plain slab sided blade is 14" long and has a distinct ricasso and a 4" false edge along the back at the spear point. The brass hilt has a re-curved guard and the distinctive pommel is shaped like that of the M/71 Pionierfaschinenmesser and its predecessors such as the M/60 Fusillier-Seitengwehr. These Prussian sidearms typically have solid brass hilts but Baden sidearms typically have slab sided grips made of leather, wood, or plastic (hard rubber). This hilt has extra cost stag horn grips affixed with two brass rivets. The black leather scabbard is typical for these sidearms with a seam down the center of the back and scalloped brass fittings with a large flat frog stud in the Imperial construction style.

    Rolf Selzer, on his website WWW.seitengewehr.de, discusses this style of sidearm in "Die Haubajonett der Koniglich Preussischen und Grossherzoglich Badischen Grenzaufseher zu Fuss". He shows similar Seitengewehre for the Baden Border Guards/Customs officials including the very similar Baden Police sidearm that has an even more exaggerated curved pommel that he indicates might have been utilized by Baden Grenzers in the brass version.

    Has anyone seen this particular style of Seitengewehr before or have any thoughts on exactly what it is?
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  2. #2
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    Here are examples of the Weimar Republic time period Baden Police sidearms that are shown in the period catalogs. The brass example with brown wooden grips is a larger item of issue while the nickeled example with black plastic grips is a smaller Extra-Seitengewehr. The brass example is the one Selzer indicates may have been used by Baden Grenzers in the 1920s - 1930s.
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    "You can't please everyone, so you have to please yourself." Ricky Nelson

  3. #3
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    A simple but elegant sidearm. Luckily they did not use these in the 1980's when I drove through Baden into France without stopping then once I realized I turned around and back into Baden
    without stopping. I did see the red and white circular sign that had Zoll on it but I was not fluent in German.

  4. #4
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    German 1880

    I believe these are German and 1880 to 1900 of a similar form.
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    The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people." --- Tench Coxe

  5. #5
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    Thanks for the comments guys. The different pommels are interesting. Eagle heads, drastically curved, and pointed. Here is an example of another Baden Extra-Seitengewehr made in the form of the M/71 hilt and pommel. Of course this sidearm has the solid brass hilt but it does have the recurved guard and the wide flat blade and similar scabbard.

    http://www.swordforum.com/vb4/showth...ighlight=baden
    "You can't please everyone, so you have to please yourself." Ricky Nelson

  6. #6
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    Were these considered a dagger or naval dirk?
    The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people." --- Tench Coxe

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Fairbanks View Post
    Were these considered a dagger or naval dirk?
    These were considered to be edged weapons "Sidearms" or Seitengewehre. Some would affix to a rifle but most would not. They could be made by the edged weapon factory as full size item of issue style sidearms or as lighter weight private purchase "Extra-Blankewaffen". That is why some latitude was allowed for Extra- bayonets and sidearms to be worn as off-duty walking out dress. Rather like extra cost private purchase swords that mimic item of issue swords but shorter.
    "You can't please everyone, so you have to please yourself." Ricky Nelson

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