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Thread: Knight vs. Samurai

  1. #1
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    Knight vs. Samurai

    A fascinating hypothetical argument. If this has been linked to before, please excuse the repetition!
    After reading this, I believe I'd put my money on the European knight. Of course, I'm partial to European weapons and armor, so I guess I'm a bit biased. Others may favor the samurai, and that's cool too. In any event, a thought-provoking article. Enjoy.http://www.thehaca.com/essays/knightvs.htm

  2. #2
    I believe this article was being discussed about a month ago at this thread: http://forums.swordforum.com/showthr...knight+samurai

    These kind of threads have a way of getting heated though.

  3. #3
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    Red face

    Oh god... another knight vs. samurai thread...

    I need a drink...

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    I could post another picture of Brigitte, just so it's not a complete waste of space, but I won't.
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  5. #5
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    I'd say Knight 58 Samurai 72. The knight has the advantage of being taller, a slightly better outside shooter and definitely has the Samurai on the rebound shots. However, the Samurai's better jump shots, passing strategy and equal skill at dribbling footwork usually will trump the Knight.
    Jay
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    I think we should start a sticky thread where we track the number of times certain threads are started anew...

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    Originally posted by Ty N.
    Oh god... another knight vs. samurai thread...

    I need a drink...
    The question is: are you gonna drink ale or saki?

    Sorry, guys. I guess I should have searched the Forum, before starting this thread. Let's jest call it a "new guy" mistake.

    Thanks, Choo-Leong. I clicked on the link you supplied. Wow! I didn't realize this was such a contentious subject. I'll do a thorough search before posting in the future. Again, my apologies.
    Last edited by G. Scott H.; 01-31-2005 at 11:16 AM.

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    G. Scott H.

    Hi, welcome to the Forum.

    I wouldn't worry to much about making mistakes, everyone gets burnt at some point!! I could send you some juicy posts that I've recieved.....

    Life is a constant struggle for Balance......Embrace the Chaos of change.

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    Many thanks, Anton. I consider myself to be fairly thick-skinned; nevertheless, nobody likes to look like an idiot and your understanding is much appreciated.

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    Originally posted by G. Scott H.
    Many thanks, Anton. I consider myself to be fairly thick-skinned; nevertheless, nobody likes to look like an idiot and your understanding is much appreciated.
    Jupp, this is a thread that has kept popping up since forever. Dont worry about it though. Youre not an idiot for asking questions, and I think this one is one we've all wondererd about at some time, which is why it keeps getting asked.

    But yeah, if you wonder about something it is a good idea to do a search if you think there is a good possiblity there is already a lot of info on it. Dont be afraid to ask questions though, that why this forum exists anyway, right?

    Welcome to the forums, by the way.
    SCHOLA GLADIATORIA

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    "Well, then maybe you should put it away," said Mrs. Whitaker.

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    I think the answer to this question depends on the individuals involved. Its like asking which is better, a European sword or a katana? The answer is "For what?" and "Which specific swords are you comparing?". I've seen both European swords and katana with bad heat treats, rat-tail tangs, etc. Likewise, I've seen fighters in both the JSA and WSA who were either very bad or very good. Comparing systems really doesn't tell you much. Its all in the execution!
    Cheers,

    Joe Gonzalez

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    I'd definitely say my money is on...

    ...the European knight. Greater average body mass, plus an exposure to several different kinds of alchoholic beverages in early youth would be a definite plus to the training. Plus, from the early Middle Ages onwards, he would be imbibing ocassionally of distilled beverages including but not limited to brandy, geneva liquor (gin) and whisky, depending on locale, and this would definitely give a typical European knight an advantage in any drinking contest.

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    Not to mention some european's use of wode...although the chinese did have opium. I wonder if any of that made it over to japan?
    - What really scares the heck out of me is that stupid people are out-breeding the smart ones.

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    Originally posted by Matt Lanteigne
    Not to mention some european's use of wode...although the chinese did have opium. I wonder if any of that made it over to japan?
    Something of hallucinogen must had be there.
    Otherwise how can you explain the creation of such a numberless
    pantheon of Kami ?
    Please forgive my english.

  15. #15
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    Originally posted by G. Scott H.
    The question is: are you gonna drink ale or saki?

    Sorry, guys. I guess I should have searched the Forum, before starting this thread. Let's jest call it a "new guy" mistake.

    Thanks, Choo-Leong. I clicked on the link you supplied. Wow! I didn't realize this was such a contentious subject. I'll do a thorough search before posting in the future. Again, my apologies.
    i'm gonna go after the sake myself...

    this should be amusing.. someone started one over on bugei and i got involved, one of the arma guys jumped in and tried shooting me down but got the thread closed after bringing up politics...

    the bottom line is, noone knows who would win.

    there IS an old story of a frenchman (could have been a spaniard) using a rapier to fight a samurai on the docks in japan, needless to say, he got a stab in, but was cut down immedaitely from shoulder to hip. the samurai walked away, the frenchman (or spaniard), obviously, did not.

    i believe that was the only known instance..
    I like swords.

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  16. #16
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    Cool story Jeff. Where did you come across that? Is there more to it?
    - What really scares the heck out of me is that stupid people are out-breeding the smart ones.

  17. #17
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    Originally posted by Matt Lanteigne
    Cool story Jeff. Where did you come across that? Is there more to it?
    it was over in the bugei thread.

    There is a story told, of a samurai who went to Europe and engaged in a duel with a sword fencer.
    Now in this time, during the duels, people would come and have tea as they watched the duel, making it into the afternoon entertainment. Usually on duelist would stab the other and the man would die or be partially injured. The duel would end, people would clap and finish their food and carried on with life.
    During the duel, the samurai parried the thrust of the european's sword and sliced the man cleanly in half, from shoulder to above the pelvis. The man's body fell in two and blood went everywhere. The people became sick as they ate and drank their tea. Usually the wagon would just carry the body away, but in this case they had to sow it together so that the entrails and insides wouldn't come out all over the streets, then they tossed it on the wagon and hauled it off.
    Moral of story, Samurai won... and don't eat when a samurai is dueling someone
    i will not post the link to the bugei thread as it had some politics brought up in it that i would prefer didnt get sperad any further..
    I like swords.

    ______________________________
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    If you want to climb a mountain, begin at the top.

    "Integrity, justice, courage, and action - without these, a person is of no consequence." - Don Nelson

    learn the way to preserve rather than destroy.
    avoid rather than check, check rather than hurt, hurt rather than maim, maim rather than kill.
    for all life is precious, not one can be replaced.

  18. #18
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    Originally posted by Jeff Ellis
    it was over in the bugei thread.



    i will not post the link to the bugei thread as it had some politics brought up in it that i would prefer didnt get sperad any further..
    the only solution really would be to take this blade:

    http://www.allsaintsblades.com/atpr02.htm

    and this blade:

    http://www.allsaintsblades.com/ATOokiyatsu.htm

    give them to two very skilled swordsmen that have nothing to prove to anyone, preferably they'd be skilled in the respective weapon given to them, and let them solve it.

    but in this day and age, dueling is illegal and someone would end up in jail.

    this thread needs a closing...
    I like swords.

    ______________________________
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    If you want to climb a mountain, begin at the top.

    "Integrity, justice, courage, and action - without these, a person is of no consequence." - Don Nelson

    learn the way to preserve rather than destroy.
    avoid rather than check, check rather than hurt, hurt rather than maim, maim rather than kill.
    for all life is precious, not one can be replaced.

  19. #19
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    Originally posted by Jeff Ellis
    there IS an old story of a frenchman (could have been a spaniard) using a rapier to fight a samurai on the docks in japan, needless to say, he got a stab in, but was cut down immedaitely from shoulder to hip. the samurai walked away, the frenchman (or spaniard), obviously, did not.
    This is a myth that's been told many times over, often times with different outcomes. If anyone can find a source for it, I'd be happy to know it. In some versions of the story, the rapier man wins, in some versions they both die.

    And the samurai would WHOOP that knight's butt at table tennis. After all, knight's can't do backflips in midair.
    Virginia Academy of Fencing Historical Swordsmanship
    --German Longsword & Italian Rapier in the DC Area--


    "A despondent heart will always be defeated regardless of all skill."

  20. #20
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    [i]....give them to two very skilled swordsmen that have nothing to prove to anyone, preferably they'd be skilled in the respective weapon given to them, and let them solve it.[/B]
    Forget it! If I had those two blades I wouldn't give them to anyone!
    Cheers,

    Joe Gonzalez

  21. #21
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    Originally posted by Jeff Ellis
    the only solution really would be to take this blade:

    http://www.allsaintsblades.com/atpr02.htm

    and this blade:

    http://www.allsaintsblades.com/ATOokiyatsu.htm

    give them to two very skilled swordsmen that have nothing to prove to anyone, preferably they'd be skilled in the respective weapon given to them, and let them solve it.

    but in this day and age, dueling is illegal and someone would end up in jail.

    this thread needs a closing...
    I think the best way would be to get at least 100 WMA artists to fight an equal number of JSA artists, one on one. That way, it would reduce the odds that the outcome would be the result of a fluke of some kind.

    Oh, and could you PM me the Bugei link? I don't offend easy.
    Last edited by Karl Eide; 01-31-2005 at 01:49 PM.
    Karl A. Eide
    SCHOLA GLADIATORIA
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    For soldiers other than officers, if they would test their armour, they should test only the front. Furthermore, whereas ornamentation on armour is unnecessary, one should be very careful about the appearance of one's helmet. It is something that accompanies one's head to the enemy's camp.
    -Anonymous general

  22. #22
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    this thread needs a closing...
    Alright, since I'm guilty of being the most recent guy to post on this subject, let me be the one to end it!

    The knight and the samurai squared off for battle. Upon hearing the predetermined signal, both combatants swung their respective swords as hard as they could. The swords met in the middle and each snapped the other in half. Disqusted with the poor quality of their eBay swords, the two warriors retired to the local pub/sushi bar for a drink and a bite to eat. The two became fast friends and were last seen running a woad and opium import/export business out of a Nevada brothel.

    The End
    Last edited by G. Scott H.; 01-31-2005 at 01:50 PM.

  23. #23
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    Re: I'd definitely say my money is on...

    Originally posted by Al Massey
    ...the European knight. Greater average body mass, plus an exposure to several different kinds of alchoholic beverages in early youth would be a definite plus to the training. Plus, from the early Middle Ages onwards, he would be imbibing ocassionally of distilled beverages including but not limited to brandy, geneva liquor (gin) and whisky, depending on locale, and this would definitely give a typical European knight an advantage in any drinking contest.
    I beg to differ, as the samurai had plenty of experience of getting absolutely plastered. It's only good manners to get drunk on your host's sake, after all.
    Karl A. Eide
    SCHOLA GLADIATORIA
    -------------------------------

    For soldiers other than officers, if they would test their armour, they should test only the front. Furthermore, whereas ornamentation on armour is unnecessary, one should be very careful about the appearance of one's helmet. It is something that accompanies one's head to the enemy's camp.
    -Anonymous general

  24. #24
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    Originally posted by Karl Eide
    I think the best way would be to get at least 100 WMA artists to fight an equal number of JSA artists, one on one. That way, it would reduce the odds that the outcome would be the result of a fluke of some kind.

    Oh, and could you PM me the Bugei link? I don't offend easy.
    pm sent
    I like swords.

    ______________________________
    SCHOLA GLADIATORIA
    ______________________________

    If you want to climb a mountain, begin at the top.

    "Integrity, justice, courage, and action - without these, a person is of no consequence." - Don Nelson

    learn the way to preserve rather than destroy.
    avoid rather than check, check rather than hurt, hurt rather than maim, maim rather than kill.
    for all life is precious, not one can be replaced.

  25. #25
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    Originally posted by Jeff Ellis
    pm sent
    Thank you very big

    To be honest, I don't have much faith in the story about the samurai fighting a duel in Europe. It's certeinly a possible scenario, but it smacks too much of urban legend stuff to me. Sort of like, "I heard that there was this ninja who was eating at a diner. And when some dude dropped a spoon the ninja killed the whole town."
    Karl A. Eide
    SCHOLA GLADIATORIA
    -------------------------------

    For soldiers other than officers, if they would test their armour, they should test only the front. Furthermore, whereas ornamentation on armour is unnecessary, one should be very careful about the appearance of one's helmet. It is something that accompanies one's head to the enemy's camp.
    -Anonymous general

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